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I honestly think everyone should learn a second language or even a third, a fourth one. It's a great way to know about other people's ideas, cultures, traditions, etc... It can also avoid the stupidity caused by arrogance and ignorance.

@dinoallosaurus I speak English as a second language and it only causes me to hate americans

@igel At least you can get to know more about them to form an opinion rather than through some translated information, which, in my opinion, is very subjective because of the translator.

@dinoallosaurus
The school system here is quite good for that, most people will learn three languages for some however will only do two, but its commeb to learn three. Not gonna say i rember much more then two of them, but stull has been nice, usefull education to some extent.

@Twelve I really appreciate those schools which provide language programs. Sometimes a person finds their interest in those languages through the programs and it helps them open the door to a whole new world.

@dinoallosaurus
I sometimes just wish there were more options. Tho still better then only learning two.

@dinoallosaurus I can say this is true wiith the language I've yet to sit down properly with, Japanese. There's a lot about their culture and language that I like and even prefer over English and its customs.
@thatbrickster @dinoallosaurus While I would like to learn another language, I've sort of come to terms that it is difficult for me to learn another language now despite my past attempts. I don't think it works for everyone. Being able to learn another language isn't a strength everyone has. I do admire it in others though.

@sim @thatbrickster I see. In my opinion, the most precious thing about language learning is the experience rather than the outcome. Even though you don't become fluent in the end, you can still learn something different.

@dinoallosaurus @thatbrickster That's an interesting way to think about it. I tend to get more frustrated that I'm not fluent, but while I was learning it was fascinating to learn about things like phrases and how they came to be. Maybe I should explore it for that reason alone, even if I can't follow conversations in another language. It's also good to consider for worldbuilding.

@sim @thatbrickster @dinoallosaurus you can't learn a language if you want to know it, you can only learn it if you are ok with not knowing it. Even with your native, from your very first words to the last, there were many and will always be some things you didn't and will never know, you just always have been and will be ok with it. WTF did I just write...

@namark @thatbrickster @dinoallosaurus Oh yeah, I don't think that was the problem. I think I'd be okay if I were fluent enough in the language like I am my native one. It's still nice that I have more words or phrases to explore in my native language. It's just not being able to follow a casual conversation or speak my thoughts in another language that gets me. I don't have to know everything, just enough.

@sim
I probably phrased it the worst way possible, but what I mean is even that is too much. Learning your first language you don't care what it all means, or whether you understand or are understood. You just listen and repeat and later indirectly discover meaning. You are also absolutely disinterested in its structure, it is not curious or fascinating, you view it in the most benign and primitive way (as in some subconscious part of your mind it actually is unremarkably simple to you). Now, it is of course difficult to revert back to a mindset of a child as an adult, not enough patience (of your own and your peers), but it's still a useful attitude to have. There should be no goal, and you should be all sorts of wrong and pointless and not care in the slightest.
@thatbrickster @dinoallosaurus

@namark @thatbrickster @dinoallosaurus Hmm. Having that child-like mindset. It must be quite difficult to bring back... especially because we tend to need to be motivated to learn another language, we're not always immersed in it like with our first language and as you said... the patience of peers. We had parents/teachers teaching us so we were able to pick it up from that. The older you get, the less inclined people are to want to teach you and you'll be judged for not knowing something if someone expects you to have gotten something. It's sort of sad. We tend to do this with ourselves as well. But you do make a good point about bringing that mindset back.

@sim
Yeah, very difficult to do on purpose, and can never be exactly the same. Still can experiment in that direction. Maybe expose yourself to the language in some comfortable way daily, just listen and repeat the phrases you like. Don't translate words, only sentences/phrases, and only after you're somewhat comfortable saying them, as kind of a substitute for (acceleration of) contextual clues/explanations. Learn reading/writing only after getting more or less comfortable with speech. Difficult without a tutor/friend who will practice it with you diligently, but on the other hand can take as long as you like if you can get into the "don't care" (in it for the lulz?...!) mindset.
For me it was circumstantial, so I'm lucky that didn't need to motivate myself in any way, but I certainly never cared much about the language itself or knowing it. Initially I would even avoid it whenever I could, being thoroughly convinced that I will never understand it.

@thatbrickster @dinoallosaurus

@dinoallosaurus …this is true for high education in general, as it is impossible to learn without prior admitting ignorance.

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